Last week at Directions EMEA, Claus Lundstrom and I had a parallel session which was a pitty because we both had interesting messaging around RDLC Reporting. Fortunately we both had a good number of attendees who got what they came for.
While my presentation was primairaly about converting Classic reports to RDLC2005, Claus told his audience about the future of reporting in NAV "7".
There are some important things to understand from Claus' session
1. Classic Reports are discontinued
In Dynamics NAV 2009 we had the possibility to run classic reports from the RTC. This will be no longer possible in "7". This means that it is mandatory to upgrade your reports in the next version.
2. NAV "7" uses RDLC 2008
NAV 2009 is currently supporting RDLC 2005 which brings along some quite important limmitations. Most important is the fact that it does not support using the dataset in the Header and Footer of the report. This causes the funny movement of data that we know from especially the document reports such as the sales invoice.
NAV "7" will run on RDLC 2008 that removes this limmitation. This is a huge step forward in terms of usability of RDLC in ERP documents
3. NAV "7" upgrades from both Classic AND RLDC2005
Reports that have been upgraded to RDLC 2005 do not have to be redesigned in RDLC 2008. NAV will provide an upgrade tool. Hopefully NAV "7" will also upgrade from classic reports with header and footer data directly to RDLC 2008 without the funny datamovement.
4. NAV "7" enables creating datasets
Currently the classic report sections design our dataset. This will no longer be the case in NAV "7" where we create the dataset directly using a new designer
5. NAV "7" will have better looking reports
Microsoft has decided to apply the Dynamics AX guides to the NAV reports to they will look better. The most frequently used reports in the standard product will be enhanced
6. We can count report usage
Remember this post? I discussed this with Microsoft and they agreed to ship a hotfix to make this possible out of the box! Watch my blog for the HF#.
7. Getting more curious?
Too bad. This is all we are allowed to blog about at the moment, or maybe already too much.
Key message?Start exploring RDLC TODAY! And start converting those reports. There is no extra effort to redo them with NAV "7" other than maybe some simplyfication where the header and footer are concerned
Orriginal Blogpost:
http://dynamicsuser.net/blogs/mark_brum ... -quot.aspx
Comments
Since this was a presentation at Directions, is this public to all partners only?
As a partner, can I get more info or is this more limited?
http://mibuso.com/blogs/davidmachanick/
Processing only reports are not affected by this message. They stay as they are today. No changes.
We always install the current release, which means:
1) all our new clients are already running SQL Server 2008, and the newer ones R2
2) all our newer clients are RTC using SP1 or R2
However we have still used Classic reports for new reports most of the time, and the current design tools are bad.
Give us the new design tool now, and it won't be such an abrupt transition to NAV 7.
http://mibuso.com/blogs/davidmachanick/
I think the biggest problem is that NOW we have further effort that we have to do to put in place the "funny movement" that Mark talked about. (you know, get&setdata/reportitems...)
Second (smaller) problem is that if the report is only run through RTC: we must build the classic designer, no matter what.
My conclusion is: if you start doing them now, you're doing the 110% of the work, not the 90%: it's quite different!
whops, i just noticed that mark already wrote
"Never memorize what you can easily find in a book".....Or Mibuso
My Blog
It's one thing to do them now. It's another to have a customer who is willing to pay you to do them now. If they are happy with classic reports there is no benefit to them, and no reason to pay.
Should every developer know how the new reporting works, absolutely. It's been around for, what, 2 1/2 years or so. Should already know it if you ask me, but maybe I'm just ambitious
My Blog - nav.education
However, it is upsetting that they will finally come out with a more usable set of tools in version 7.
SQL Server 2008 has been out for longer than NAV 2009. They could have started out with SQL Server 2008 with its better RDLC and a better way of handling the datasets. (SQL Server 2005 support should only have been available for Classic clients.)
We have been pushed into the "Vista" version of RTC.
They should have done more work on the development tools before releasing the product.
http://mibuso.com/blogs/davidmachanick/
I have got one question. Most of our customers who went live with NAV2009 use classic reports form RTC. This made us lazy to design RTC reports. So there are cases when the existing RTC layout is deleted to allow classic report changes. Will the upgrade or the tool you are talking about redesign these RTC reports as per classic reports, or should these be done manually.
We have to create manually..
-Mohana
http://mohana-dynamicsnav.blogspot.in/
https://www.facebook.com/MohanaDynamicsNav
Give a try on Suggest Layout...
Regards,
Raveendran.BS
suggest layout does not work i checked it when NAV2009 was released. I did suggest other developers not to delete layout, or fields which are nto needed as part of customization. But its too late now. The manual doesn't contain full RTC report design. It's missing the code bit, and someother stuff which i can't remember now at this minute
-Mohana
http://mohana-dynamicsnav.blogspot.in/
https://www.facebook.com/MohanaDynamicsNav
-Mohana
http://mohana-dynamicsnav.blogspot.in/
https://www.facebook.com/MohanaDynamicsNav
There are somany users who dont know this..
Dont think too much about the tool and follow this message
-Mohana
http://mohana-dynamicsnav.blogspot.in/
https://www.facebook.com/MohanaDynamicsNav
It's better not to wait in my opinion.
RIS Plus, LLC
MVP - Business Apps
We get fantastic new capabilities and lose a few of the old. Have to find new ways to solve the old problems.
In pre-historic times I worked with Cobol apps. Their performance would blow away the current apps, but the lack of features and difficulties in extending the programs was a killer.
Plus - they became extremely painful to work on once I embraced and came up to speed on newer technology.
http://mibuso.com/blogs/davidmachanick/
AP Commerce, Inc. = where I work
Getting Started with Dynamics NAV 2013 Application Development = my book
Implementing Microsoft Dynamics NAV - 3rd Edition = my 2nd book
The user will run it in preview and see crap, of course. He has to export it to excel and outosize the columns, but this method is even faster than excel buffer on classic, and doesn't need programming
"Never memorize what you can easily find in a book".....Or Mibuso
My Blog
So yes to import and convert; no to run as Classic.
http://mibuso.com/blogs/davidmachanick/
It is not about learning, it is about
1) Actually I realized Excel reports are much more superior in many ways. Printable things, with the exception of documents, are outdated - we are not living in a paper age anymore. In fact I believe we should change our whole way of thinking - it shouldn't be reports but queries, datasets which can be processed further.
2) organizational inertia - if something works right, people will never understand why the vendor wants to break it and force you to redo it and introduce a possibility of errors. Everybody hates solving the same problem twice.
3) I don't care about others becoming better at it - do you? First of all demand for us still outstrips supply and probably will for a long time - there is little competition. Not in skill level, maybe in prices. Second, am in this for 10 years know and really want to get promoted out of physical coding / report design, hope I will achieve it soon. I think 10 years of hands-on work are enough. I think now in my thirties I should get into project management or something like that and leave hands-on work for people in their twenties. Especially report design, that should be left for the newest folks. I know you spent more than my 10 years in it, so what is your opinion about that? Do you still do hands-on work and do you intend to keep doing so?
I am not talking about user-ran reports. To be fair I consider that "pull" methodology outdated and inefficient. I am talking about generating reports with NAS and Excel Buffer into files during the night and emailing them out. (Technically non-GUI Excel Automation is not supported but practically it works if I comment out the page layout code.)
This "push" attitude is a whole lot more preferable from an organizational point of view. For example if you automatically "push" the overdue invoices report to an accountant every night he has no excuses for forgetting to send reminders. If reports are ran by the users then they will just forget to use them.
What you say about its slowness worries me, but I think if it comes to it we can just replace the CreateSheet function with an appropriate .NET function. Can't be that hard.
Most new prospects assumes that NAV uses SSRS for it's primary reporting tool. Almost no one I came across knows what RDLC is.
AP Commerce, Inc. = where I work
Getting Started with Dynamics NAV 2013 Application Development = my book
Implementing Microsoft Dynamics NAV - 3rd Edition = my 2nd book
But if you are going to use SQL queries and thus lose the advantages of FlowFields (unless you use SIFT tables which is downright hideous), then there is no need for third-party-solutions. SQL is pretty much DIY, very easy.
- Excel PowerPivot. Download it, enjoy it, it is awesome.
- Simple "cubes" - a bunch of SUM and GROUP by on Entry Tables. A table of 200K entries becomes a view of 11K which even "normal" Excel Pivot can process easily and if you just copy it into another table every night then it is even faster.
- There are a million tutorials how to generate an Excel report from an SQL query through ADO
- sp_makewebtask can make a HTML table
ok...nas is classic client, excel buffer shouldn't be slow (never tried)
I'm with you with report pushing and "query reports"
"Never memorize what you can easily find in a book".....Or Mibuso
My Blog
How do you lose the advantage of FlowFields if you go to SQL? In the end, a FlowField is simply a SUM, COUNT, etc. query in the database, and there is no need to use the generated views.
Pivotier is a tool that allows ad-hoc SQL reporting via RDL straight out of NAV. An end user with no knowledge of SQL can build their own reports, and Pivotier does all the heavy lifting for them. A SSRS developer can develop a report in Visual Studio and load it back into NAV so that it can be run with NAV filters. Pivotier avoids having to use the clumsy RDLC implementation of NAV reporting and performs MUCH faster. There is also the added benefit of SQL optimization in a NAV database... Pivotier will automatically execute queries that implement all the functionality to prevent blocking, etc. To top it off, the footprint in NAV is extremely light.
Once data is in a SSRS report, then you can get it to Excel easily or into a variety of other formats. You also gain all the other benefits SSRS offers (hosting them on a company Intranet portal, automated batch routines, emailing, etc.). In my mind, Pivotier is the reporting engine that NAV 2009 should have had.
Excel is a powerful tool, but as a standalone reporting engine it is rather fragile. Coupled with that, the regular users shouldn't be required to open Excel to go get the information they are looking for... things should be a one-click straight out of NAV, and Pivotier offers this out of the box.
Maybe my two cents... although I wasn't asked... IMO, as long as you think you want to get into project management, you're not ready yet
with best regards
Jens
Whether you print to a piece of paper or a digitally rendered layout, the layout itself will still need to be designed.
Not on a personal level, but from an organizational standpoint heck yes I always want to be better than the competition, I always want to learn the new stuff before the other guy. Maybe not always ME but certainly someone in my organization
Hands-on, what does that mean anyway. Whatever I do I am hands-on with it. Hands-on consulting, hands-on business analysis, hands-on performance troubleshooting, hands-on design, hands-on whatever. The reality is it there's another 25-30 years to go before I can retire, so I better keep up with current technology if I want to stay relevant. I don't mind at all, I like the challenge.
Maybe you want to stop evolving, but that will make you an old man by the time you are 50
The point I was trying to make was that people are artificially holding on to the existing report designer it seems because they feel that learning the new one is too difficult. All I am saying do so at your own peril because everyone else will be miles ahead of you before you realize that you are behind.
RIS Plus, LLC
MVP - Business Apps